We cool. The TRUST factor is my biggest argument. And i agree that if you have players you KNOW you can trust, the process is easier. But i’m sure that you know as well as i do that all things in life aren’t easy and some paths will be more “rocky” than others.

As for Phil Jax, the position in LA is the one i was referencing. I think the Chicago position was one where he was in the right place at the right time.

Peace bruh!

I agree with TRUST however when you have players that you can trust, it makes things a lot better for all those involved.

When Jordan started to get help from Pippen, Grant, etc., was it because his help came in an already high-quality player(s), or was it because Jordan’s TRUST in them gave them confidence and actually elevated their games to another level? There’s no question that it was the latter. It couldn’t have been in 1987 because neither Grant nor Pippen were starters. Oak was at the 4 and i’m not sure who was at the 3 ( i want to say Brad Sellers).

I seem to remember hearing John Paxson (i think) saying it was Tex Winter saying that if he didn’t trust his teammates, he would never win an NBA title. Therefore, he started trusting his teammates and you already know the rest.

Also, I think that Phil Jackson might be the most overrated coach in NBA history. When you can inherit a team with the blue-print to win a championship already in place, then your quest for that achievement is much easier. I would like to see him inherit a team of nobodies and then turn them into a playoff or championship caliber team. If he does that, then i might agree that he deserves all the credit he gets.

Peace!

I believe exactly what i initially stated — that great players make those around them better. I don’t think it’s necessary to have other ‘high-quality’ players to ascend to the highest level (eventhough it certainly helps), but there are those who have the ability and leadership to elevate even the least quality guy into an all-star (look at what Chris Paul did with David West). Before Jason Kidd went to New Jersey, they were at best an 8th seeded team. Enter Kidd in the mix, and the Nets go to the Finals twice. I seem to recall that Kidd was the only All-Star that team had before Kenyon Martin and Richard Jefferson transcended to another level.

Magic and Bird always played with several elite players but that doesn’t negate or take away from their uncanny ability to make even the most unexpected player play a vital role for the team. Just how good would A.C. Green would’ve been if he hadn’t played in LA? I don’t recall Isiah being labelled selfish in his early years, especially since he once set a league record for most assist in a season, but i digress.

Your point regarding Dominique is perhaps the main reason why he never got his due as one of the all-time greats. But was it that the Hawks didn’t have the quality players or was it that Nique didn’t have what it took to elevate his teammates? I think it was a combination of both, but more of the former than the latter. I would argue that Hawks ownership at the time didn’t have the personnel to run a basketball team. But i will say that Dominique did eventually figure it out. Unfortunately for him, he was traded to the Clippers when he was having perhaps his best season as a pro.

Michael Jordan suffered from the same criticism early in his career - even though he played with guys like Corzine and Banks and others at the end of the respective ropes. No one remembers the players from the years when Jordan first joined the Bulls. For the most part, they were an unspectacular lot. When the talent level in Chicago increased - when guys who could reliably MAKE outside jumpers (Hodges and Kerr) were on the roster, Jordan was suddenly deemed to be a team player.

Jordan was labelled selfish in his early years. But WHEN he started trusting his teammates is when their talent level increased. If a player doesn’t have his star player’s trust and confidence then how can his talent level ever increase?

With Cleveland, we’ve already seen flashes of Lebron and how he can elevate those around him, as evidenced by their appearance in the Finals last year. The team that went to the Finals last year consisted of Larry Hughes, Damon Jones, and who else? Not exactly an all-time great line-up but they elevated their game by following the lead of their star player is the point. I thik with Lebron, he was still learning how to play the game during those “too unselfish” labels. It’s like he couldn’t make up his mind on whether or not he wanted to be Magic Johnson or Lebron James. With his level of play in the last few years, I think he’s chosen to be Lebron James.

Great players live in the FLOW of the game - and when they make the decision to shoot instead of pass (especially in big games), it tends to be because they believe they are doing the right thing. To paraphrase an ancient saying from another world, “When the shooter is ready, the passer appears.”

If great players live in the FLOW of the game, then the decision they make should be for the good of the team and not the good of their own personal achievements. There are/were very few who could make that distinction — especially when it mattered most and Jordan just happened to be one of those people, and in my opinion, the best that ever did it. And with all due respect, that quote could work the other way around:

“When the passer is ready, the shooter appears.”

Hetep!

Charles Oakley was notorious for his inability to finish around the rim. He was an old school power forward who couldn’t jump over a phone book - and it was a no-brainer to let him go to the Knicks.

Check out this link:
http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/CHI/1988.html

It’s no wonder that Jordan shot as much as he did. Aside from raw, new players like Grant and Pippen, the Bulls interior offense was contingent on Corzine (not a chance), a fossilized Artis Gilmore, tissue paper Brad Sellers, and a grounded Charles Oakley. They still won 50 games in a super competitive Eastern Conference.

I believe Phil Jackson gets a great deal more credit than I’m willing to give him. Jerry Krause and Jerry West brought in the players that made the Bulls and Lakers champions. I believe Phil deserves a great deal of credit - but Jordan and Bryant were not ignant ass hicks who rolled in off the street with no background in the game.

Jordan, as you may recall, played for Dean Smith - and with James Worthy and Sam Perkins and Jimmy Black and Kenny Smith and Brad Daugherty. In all seriousness, some players already bring a great deal to the table. I believe that Phil’s greatest influence may have actually been on role players and the supporting cast - guys like BJ Armstrong, Toni Kukoc, and others.