Friday Fire: Vince Young, Whatcha Gonna Do Bruh?

107 Responses to “Friday Fire: Vince Young, Whatcha Gonna Do Bruh?”

1. Co Co Says:
   September 12th, 2008 at 3:43 am

   I don’t know if Vince is depressed or whatever, but my main problem is everyone is so quick to think it’s just football related. That man could be going through some things that have absolutely nothing to do with football. He’s just a man at the end of the day, unfortunately his problems will play out under the bright lights.

2. origin Says:
   September 12th, 2008 at 3:55 am

   Whats up brotha Mizzo. I am so glad that you commented on this BS incident. This whole mess is nothing more then the MSM feasting on black QB flesh.

   First let me address that uncle tom unicron looking whitlock. This is the same fool that called Vince a thug after the rose bowl. This is the same dude who said Vince hangs with a posse like NBA players. Realize Vince’s so called posse consisted of his 2 childhood friends his agent and his Uncle. Then that c&&n whitlock had the nerve to say that Vince was dumb for picking a agent who has never been an agent before. Now this was wrong from the start the agent that vince picked is a friend of the family and has represented a few NFL players before Vince.

   See this is the same whitlock who defended TO when he was in Philly and called out Mcnabb saying he was a company man and should take TO’s side. See whitlock is nothing more then a flip flopping pandering fool. I didn’t read that fools article because I am taking a lesson from brotha Kevdog (why give that c&&n a hit by clicking the link). But let me guess what he said about Vince his lack of a male role model is the reason he is having these issues right? Maybe its because of all the rap music right?

   Whitlocks crap is the usual garbage. Also Vince’s uncle has helped raise him since he was young and Mcnair has been in his lfe since he was a teen. Or how about Mcnair never having his father is his life. Seems like he turned out alright.

   Anyway I was disappointed in Vince with what he stated about Mcnabb last year. But he was in denial and felt if he played the game the MSM would be light on him. But I believe the young brotha now knows that ain’t no being light on a black QB when it comes to the media.

   At the press conference today he asked the media why all this uproar about this. He stated how he treats everyone in the media with respect and is polite. Then he said that he never gets in trouble or commits crimes. The people in the press conference didn’t say anything.

   Vince brotha I am not sure if you still understand. They don’t give a F%%# you are a black QB if they can dig some dirt on you from 4th grade they would. Maybe bring up you credit score if its too low in their eye. Anything to throw you under the bus.

   But Mizzo I still have fate in this youg brotha one because I think he has been mentored by good folks like Mcnair from a young age and also because I think that eventually he will get it all together. For starts he needs to stop being so nice to the media. I think the worse mistake he made was doing the 60 minutes interview. It seemed as though they tried to make him seem as though he was a malcontent. Thats when the media started to play this whole attitude crap.

   As we talked about earlier brotha Mizzo alot of young black QBs careers are riding on Vince, Campbell and Russell. Thes brothas were drafted high and if they don’t pan out. The next generation will have it that much harder. And I am not just talking about brothas at the QB position going pro I am also talking about brothas at the college ranks getting a chance.

   But why would it be any different brotha Mizzo. We as black folks always have to do well so the next brotha or sista will get some what of a fair shake.

   Also Mizzo Vince said that he has been chating with Mcnair and Mcnabb this week. The word on the street is Mcnair came down to Nashville to hollar at him. So he is getting some feed back from these brotha. I am glad to hear.

3. origin Says:
   September 12th, 2008 at 4:01 am

   True sista CoCo. Also since the media is so quick to call him a quitter or make it seem as though he wants to kill himself. No one ever thought that maybe he was scared that his knee injury could be serious like Brady. Speaking of Brady it just amazes me how the kid gloves were put on when it came to Brady’s injury. Yet when the media tries to portrait Vince as a man who is about to commit suicide. The kid gloves come off.

   I just think Vince just needed sometime alone (like we all do). And was frustrated that he had an injury. Nothing more nothing less.

   But the MSM made it personal its as if they want this dude to have mental issues. It reminds me of the TO incident last year. You could tell that those MFers in the MSM wanted to commit suicide. Its like they had a freaking hard on when they heard he was in the hospital.

4. Miranda Says:
   September 12th, 2008 at 10:51 am

   The MSM pulled out their old “Kordell Stewart Blueprint”….just updated it a little and now they’re gonna apply it to Vince. We’ve seen it all before.

   Fatlock is a slug. He is a spineless slug. He has no honor, no conscious, no original thoughts. If it wasn’t for his race-baiting, exploitive columns, he would be just another accounts payable team leader in some faceless corporation just waiting for his angioplasty some day. He has to rely on these type columns in order to get attention because he doesn’t have the talent nor the courage to do otherwise.

5. Eric Daniels Says:
   September 12th, 2008 at 1:26 pm

   Miranda very true, I read the Whitlock article and it looked he was so smug in saying that VY was not ready for prime time. And in his role as “HNIC”, he goes slamming young black ballplayers because VY is having growing pains like Matt Lineart at QB. “Big Pork Chop” is assuming he knows all 1,800 black male ballplayers who play professional sports and it’s his duty when he is the biggest hypocrite writing himself. I could respect this if it came from Jon Saunders or Stuart Scott or even Bill Rhoden but not Whitlock or Drew Sharp.

6. rashad Says:
   September 12th, 2008 at 1:34 pm

   I saw a stat yesterday that said Vince’s record as a starting QB is 18-11. Even though he is putting my Jim McMahon numbers, the W-L is what should be most important. That being said, I can’t help but wonder how much of this intense scrutiny was fueled by his I-am-thinking-of-retiring speech last year. If he is depressed on feeling down he needs to talk to someone, and not let his ego get in the way. But if he’s fine and just a little bummed about the injury, he’ll be just fine.

7. Mizzo Says:
   September 12th, 2008 at 1:44 pm

   Rashad the scrutiny started with him not winning the Heisman. I don’t want to hear Reggie Bush because he had all kinds of talent on his team and lost to VY head to head.

   Then it became Wunderlic.

   Then the throwing motion.

8. DavidMac Says:
   September 12th, 2008 at 1:50 pm

   Vince needs to kick his mom to the curb. She is talking to reckless in public and it is probably her annoying ass that called Fisher sounding worried.

   Vince needs to branch out from her and start becoming his own man, he is too old for that momma’s boy -ish.

9. KevDog Says:
   September 12th, 2008 at 2:22 pm

   Scrapplin’ Lips ain’t even worth all this server space ya’ll. Let the Tom alone with his masters.

10. Miranda Says:
    September 12th, 2008 at 2:36 pm

    Eric, none of those other writers would hypothesize something so incredibly stupid. That column was just a race-baiting piece to attempt to get him some airtime. He threw in the reference to Chad and the comment about T.O. to make SURE it was clear he’s just talking about the darkies. See, he starts out by saying its about the role of “Quarterbacks”….but his inevitable hatred always slips out and the obvious becomes crystal clear. Thi is just about black athletes and his contrived attempts to be the Pastor Manning of Sports.

11. Temple3 Says:
    September 12th, 2008 at 3:33 pm

    Actually,

    I seldom agree with Whitlock, but he raises some very good points in this particular article. I haven’t followed this most recent drama with Vince Young. I’m not close enough to him to have an impact. However, if there is truth to every thing that has been reported, there is an issue here. CoCo is right to put the issue where it belongs. The real deal could be about something off the field. I didn’t see the Titans game. Whitlock accuses Young of quitting DURING the game. That’s a big deal.

    I do believe that most of us (as a people) suffer from our lack of knowledge and we have developed “thin skins” through a process of whipping and skinning and bleaching and scraping and scrapping. In many instances, it’s justified. In many instances, it’s not. It’s hard to know the difference sometimes. I don’t believe Whitlock genuinely cares about that nuance or Vince Young…and that’s the bottom line.

    There is a place for tough love and for providing guidance and wisdom. Children need to see their fathers EVERY DAY doing regular things and extraordinary things. Whether the work/play is exciting or boring is immaterial. What matters is that daddy is demonstrating the RIGHT way to do it. That’s the essence of Whitlock’s piece. If you scrape away all the other “stuff,” I can agree with that essence. I’m sure you do.

    I’ve always said that the more we know our own story, the more liberated we will become. We are acting out a bizarre, reactionary comedy at the hands of the very people we introduced to civilization. On some levels, it is so tragically comical that all I can do is laugh. But, there are times like this when laughter just seems inappropriate.

    On the eve of the draft, Whitlock wrote this: “Young’s success in the NFL will hinge almost exclusively on his willingness to prepare.”

    Mizzo, you just issued a flaming call for Vince to do precisely what Whitlock said he was unwilling to do.

    I haven’t seen him play this year. I don’t know that he loves the film room or that he seeks to bond with his offensive linemen. I saw him duke it out with a wide receiver on his team (I don’t recall the issue and made a conscious effort not to judge either player, though the media spin on the event favored VY.)

    If Vince is not studying teams, he’s going to be unemployed very soon. There is simply no way around it. He probably should have won the Heisman Trophy, but that’s yesterday’s news. So, too, is his high draft position. His success will hinge on his mental toughness. That’s not always easy to come by — especially when you don’t have a road map and you invent every day with the rising of the sun.

    I’m not so sure that you are JW are far apart on your assessment of what has transpired or what is to come.

    For the record: I don’t ascribe any malice to what Jeff Fisher did because I don’t have the details. From what I’ve read here - a multi-million $$ QB disappears with out his cell phone. Given the shooting death of Sean Taylor, the shooting in Jacksonville, the robberies in Chicago and the general lawlessness attached to folks preying on NFL players, I probably would have done the same thing.

    The word “prepare” means “to work out the details of: to plan in advance.”

    Is VY prepared for every game? I don’t know. Based on your article, Mizzo, I’d have to say he isn’t. That’s troubling…and part of it may or may not be attributable to his roots — but according to JW, that’s beside the point. I think it was wise of him to exclude that consideration (even if he bitched up and snuck it in there on the side).

    What should fathers being saying to their sons about preparing for EVERY SINGLE DAY? Doesn’t it all start with how we go to bed? Holla back.

12. origin Says:
    September 12th, 2008 at 4:04 pm

    As far as preparing Temple I don’t think thats his issue. This is the same man who before this year did the mcnabb thing and held a training camp with his WRs in the off season in Houston. As far as the fighting goes, he was fighting a DB who he felt ruffed up his WR with a dirty hit while he was going over the middle.

    This is a young man who was working on his degree this offseason but flying back to nashville every weekend to study game film and go over the new offense with his new OC. Even in texas the young man organized practices with his offense in the off season. Preparation isn’t this young mans issue. The pressure might be. The pressure to win with another new OC and crappy WRs. The pressure to live up to the hype. The pressure about him being a black QB (that is always compared to vick). The constant hate this young man has had to deal with throughout college and in the pros. I have never in recent memory seen a QB raked over the coals like this dude.

    That was always my beef with whitlock when it came to Vince. From calling him a thug 3 years ago. To saying he was basically lazy when that has never been the case. But aren’t these same garbage @ss issues brought up with every black QB. People have said Mcnabb wasn’t preparing for years (whitlock included, don’t be tricked by him saying he is a Mcnabb fan now). Yet Mcnabb is one of the hardest workers to ever play the game.

13. Temple3 Says:
    September 12th, 2008 at 4:50 pm

    Mizzo:

    Thanks for including your words about the role of extended family. That’s how we’ve done it for years. In some cases it works better than others, but that’s the way we’ve done it.

    Whitlock doesn’t write within the cultural fabric of the Black experience. Perhaps that’s my way of conceptualizing the distinctions between your piece and his. Yours rings of an organic construction. JW’s piece, while resonating on several levels, is external. Miranda hit on that in her post…eventually, it all comes to the surface.

    I know that wasn’t the focal point of your piece, but I would love to hear more about the extent to which extended families play a role in the maturation of players. In my own personal case, my extended family has always emphasized diligence, focus and integrity. Something as simple as “Stay in ‘dem books,” means the entire world if you really GET IT.

    Stay in them playbooks. Stay in that film room. Real simple lessons on life from the ones who love us.

    Thanks for this again. You’ve opened up the gateway to a beautiful weekend. Our Friday, our Fire!!!

14. KevDog Says:
    September 12th, 2008 at 5:33 pm

    T3

    As you know, it ain’t the message, it’s the messenger…….

    AND the audience…….

    AND the double standards.

15. Matthew Fudge Says:
    September 12th, 2008 at 5:57 pm

    What everyone has to remember is that the issue isn’t about Vince Young not having a father in his life, but the absence of a father as it relates to how he overcomes adversity. Blaming his mother for coming to his defense would be wrong. That’s what mothers do. But when the boos come and the doubters show up, how do you respond, as Donovan McNabb would say. I doublt very seriously that Young would’ve been pouting on the sidelines and having to be practically shoved on the field had he had a strong male figure in his life. Whether you agree with J-Whit or not, at least he helped open the door for discussion about how important it is for black men to take their place as fathers and leaders in the home. Perhaps this can also lead to black women holding black men accountable as far as raising their kids, as well as black men holding each other accountable.

16. Mizzo Says:
    September 12th, 2008 at 6:15 pm

    Mattew Fudge. Writing about this on Fox Sports is never the way to start a discussion. Forget Jason Whitlock.

17. Matthew Fudge Says:
    September 12th, 2008 at 6:18 pm

    Hey, Miz. It’s gotta start somewhere, whether it’s Fox Sports or CNN (with that B.S. special “Black in America”). Change won’t come unless we’re honest with ourselves as a people about what ails us and do what we have to do OURSELVES, instead of waiting for another Martin or Malcolm to walk through the door.

18. Mizzo Says:
    September 12th, 2008 at 6:24 pm

    My name is out there and I figured if I write a piece that will be passed around the web somebody is gonna see it and get the point I am trying to make.

    No it’s not going to stop everything. I would be a fool to think that but there has to be a loud check and balance so these dumb mufuckas know I’m coming. I’m gonna do it every single time.

    I didn’t disagree with Jason’s points altogether, I just can’t tolerate Jason writing them for WHITE people to read.

    There is a huge difference.

19. Matthew Fudge Says:
    September 12th, 2008 at 6:30 pm

    What difference does it make whether white people see our dirty laundry or not? What, if we keep it behind close doors, we’ll finally be able to live as equals in the USA? Black men won’t be locked up at a disproportionate rate? HIV/AIDS won’t hit black folks (and black women in particular) like a time bomb? The majority of Black folks who are killed won’t be killed by other black people? All that’ll change if we keep it behind closed doors?? No. We have to get to a point where we handle our business ourselves for our families and the generations coming after us. Forget what white people think. They’ll think what they want anyway.

20. Mizzo Says:
    September 12th, 2008 at 6:42 pm

    Matthew Fudge why can’t Jason take his message to the hood where it won’t lose effectiveness. Fox could give a damn about Black people. Let’s speak the truth here and don’t bullshit any longer.

    This is my job dude. I know the game. I know how all these so called Black writers capitulate just for a pay check.

    Who would take their message seriously?

    All the points you make above are valid. Jason Whitlock is not the man to scream them across a White sea.

    The gloves have to come off so the truth can be seen.

    None of these people deserve a pass any longer. If we just let them be then this shit will continue and a bunch of Jason Whitlocks will be spawned. Forget that!

    Sorry dude but it’s way deeper than what you speak. Trust me. Why is there not ONE single Black voice but there are THOUSANDS of White voices?

    He needs to be somewhere with Hammer making commercials.

    “Whose beeper keep beepin’ and beepin’?”

21. Mizzo Says:
    September 12th, 2008 at 6:57 pm

    This is not about airing dirty laundry. That’s ridiculous. I could care less. I laid it out hardcore in the piece what Vince Young needs to do.

    In every football game that has ever been played there are cats who get their spirit broke. If you’ve played the game you full well know. Yes, Vince is the field general and thus should be judged accordingly but so should every single player in the league–White or Black.

22. Matthew Fudge Says:
    September 12th, 2008 at 7:11 pm

    Miz, am I to understand you don’t have a problem with the message, just the messenger?

23. KevDog Says:
    September 12th, 2008 at 7:15 pm

    Matthew Fudge says

    “What difference does it make whether white people see our dirty laundry or not? ”

    LOLOL.

    Sheeeeeeeeeiiiiiiiiiiiiiittttttttt!!!!!!!!!!

24. Matthew Fudge Says:
    September 12th, 2008 at 7:17 pm

    Kev, our dirty laundry stays out in plain sight. They already know what kind of laundry we have. Trying to keep it hidden won’t make a difference at this point. It definitely won’t help us any.

25. Mizzo Says:
    September 12th, 2008 at 7:22 pm

    Matthew did you read my post? Do you understand cats like Jason Whitlock (I will give him credit for his stance on the subject but his name is convenient in this context) are the reason why the Yankees are out of the playoffs?

    Figure that one out!

    It’s time for Black writers to stop kissing ass and put up or shut up!

26. Matthew Fudge Says:
    September 12th, 2008 at 7:37 pm

    Miz, the truth is the truth. Whether it’s Jason Whitlock, Rick Reilly, Scoop Jackson, Jemele Hill, Gary Smith, Bill Plaschke, or the crackhead on the corner saying it. If he were writing for TSF or BlackVoices.com, all well and good. But I’m not gonna dismiss what he’s saying just because of who’s cashing his checks. Ralph Wiley spoke more truth on ESPN.com than any five conscious black writers put together, including Whitlock.

27. Mizzo Says:
    September 12th, 2008 at 7:45 pm

    Yes the truth is the truth.

    Answer my question please. Please. Why isn’t there one Black national writer (Scoop, Rob Parker and Bill Rhoden are the only ones as far as I know) that can write without being compromised.

    I don’t think you understand the game Matthew. As long as cats like Whitlock are allowed to speak, there will be no Black voice to break through. White people don’t want to hear that shit.

    The mainstream wants its sports devoid of politics, but that sure as hell ain’t reality is it?

    Thanks for op to plug this…

    I interviewed Cole Wiley recently. His 3 hour interview will be posted here on Tuesday.

28. Mizzo Says:
    September 12th, 2008 at 7:46 pm

    One other thing. The line about the writers is hypothetical. We must deal with truth as it happens.

    None of that if this or but that shit.

    If any of you “Black” writers would have spoken up Barry Bonds would have played this year. Instead you tucked your tails out of fear.

29. Matthew Fudge Says:
    September 12th, 2008 at 7:47 pm

    True, Miz.

30. KevDog Says:
    September 12th, 2008 at 7:57 pm

    MF says

    “Kev, our dirty laundry stays out in plain sight. They already know what kind of laundry we have. Trying to keep it hidden won’t make a difference at this point. It definitely won’t help us any.”

    I don’t know if you’re new to the game or what. But this has been hashed and re-hashed here and SOMM dozens of times. Not to be dismissive or rude, but I suggest you do some DD and then hollar back.

31. Matthew Fudge Says:
    September 12th, 2008 at 8:01 pm

    In answer to your question, “Why isn’t there one Black national writer (Scoop, Rob Parker and Bill Rhoden are the only ones as far as I know) that can write without being compromised)”, there are two reasons:

    1) To be uncompromised, you have to fearless and have a strong self-awareness and sense of integrity.

    2) Two, whoever you write for has to have the same things and be willing to back those writers up.

    Unfortunately, as two Bush terms have shown, integrity within MSM is in VERY short supply.

    Look forward to reading your interview with Cole Wiley.

32. Mizzo Says:
    September 12th, 2008 at 8:03 pm

    Hold up….Did you just call Jason Whitlock a conscious writer?

33. Matthew Fudge Says:
    September 12th, 2008 at 8:05 pm

    Yes, I did. And no, that doesn’t mean I agree with everything he says. But at least he puts stuff on the table that too many folks (black and white) are afraid to talk about.

34. Temple3 Says:
    September 12th, 2008 at 8:09 pm

    I couldn’t agree more with Kev Dog’s take on the messenger. That’s why my comments were so qualified. I perceive Whitlock the way that Mizzo does. I believe that his aim is to showcase pathology in one direction. I don’t believe he is contributing positively to a national conversation, moreover, if there is to be a national conversation about Black manhood in this generation, the first salvo should not be fired by Fox.com.

    Matt:

    It’s not so much a question of dirty laundry as it is one of testing the logic of JW’s pronouncements. There is no money in defending Black folk from media attacks or fan-based attacks. There is no money in placing a spotlight on white folks who cross the line. No one in the MSM does that with any regularity.

    Phil Spector killed a perfectly attractive (ie., normal) blond, white woman in LA. He’s a huge name and a bit of a loon. No media spectacle outside of a few nut jobs in LA. No one cared. No money in demonstrating pervasive white pathology. Not a cent. Whitlock and Hill and others, then, don’t go there.

    Of this side of the coin, they traffic in the imagery of racial demonization and grant license to evil doing caucs. That’s the problem. This is basic psychology. It’s why the MSM ALWAYS pronounces Arabic names with a short “a” instead of the standard pronounciation (”at” vs. “alms”). It’s a way to psychologically shift the ground and minimize the target. Whitlock and Hill contribute to this work on a regular basis.

    His hitting the target on a few points does not redeem him in any way. His wages are of sin and contrived to cause death — his naysaying, notwithstanding. Whitlock must engage in considerable deceit and esteem-building for whites. That’s the job description. No one’s talking about Roger Clemens anymore. That was quick. No one’s talked about Rick Ankiel all season. That was quick. The perennial contender - the St. Louis Cardinals languish in the cellar while their “dreamiest-est-est” player and manager detox from ‘roids and booze. The silence from BSWFM’s (black sportswriters workin’ fa massuh) is simply deafening. They not only can’t get it past their white colleagues and editors, they probably never even wrote the story. And, that is how you restrain an elephant with a piece of rope.

    I don’t want you to miss Mizzo’s point (and I don’t profess to speak for him). It’s just that I had these thoughts and I certainly appreciate the subtlety of what I think I hear Bro. Mizzo saying. I also hear what you’re saying.

    From a more practical standpoint, I wouldn’t want to start a community meeting with a piece written by Whitlock. I’d want to create a dialogue with something that everyone could access, but I’d want to really focus on talking about solutions…research-based approaches to resolving this (there are thousands of good, solid pieces done by BLACK folk on this very issue) and also on creating interpersonal connections so that brothers don’t feel isolated in facing the challenges of fatherhood. It happens to everyone. I feel like that sometimes - with graduate degrees, with gig, with home, with family. It happens and the resolution is in us coming together — not in kicking bullshit proscriptives on a Fox web site.

    Jason and Jemele don’t traffic in solutions. They traffic in car crashes and street wrecks. The next time you see them highlight some BLACK people in a community doing work to build living solutions will be the FIRST time. It ain’t gonna happen - so they need to stop fronting and just put the “Coon for Sale” sign up on the door. It would be easier for everyone.

35. Co Co Says:
    September 12th, 2008 at 8:30 pm

    In my mind it’s simple Jason Whitlock’s main goal is to seperate himself from “those black people” he’s not one of “those” if you know what I mean. That’s what all of his articles say. It’s like I’ll prove to yall I am not one of “them” because I’m going to put “them” on blast every chance I get. That’s pretty much all I have to say about this.

36. Mizzo Says:
    September 12th, 2008 at 8:48 pm

    Temple you are correct in assessing we shouldn’t be having this discussion in the throes of a Whitlock piece. That’s the truest.

    I must say to all of you who I’ve offended with my crass and what you might consider “ignorant” profanity that it’s time for some shock value.

    I’m not trying to be on the trail of tears. I’m sorry. This game has to be shaken up violently.

    Temple is right there are thousands of articles written on this subject that don’t come to the fore.

    I know you all question my loyalty to Jemele, but once again I gotta come to her defense.

    That’s my peoples right there. She’ll be alright. Stand down Black men

37. TADOne Says:
    September 12th, 2008 at 9:38 pm

    Nice piece, Miz. Oh, and you forgot Drew Sharp. But I don’t really like him much anyway.

38. Mizzo Says:
    September 12th, 2008 at 9:55 pm

    Thanks. Drew Sharp for what? He’s as bad as Jason.

39. Patrick Says:
    September 13th, 2008 at 2:17 am

    The media tried to break McNabb in 2006 with Rush Limabugh/Terrell Owens.

    In 2007 it is Vick..

    Now its 2008 and its Vince Young’s turn..and Tarvaris Jackson better watch out too..

40. origin Says:
    September 14th, 2008 at 12:43 am

    Patrick you ain’t never lied brotha. In 2011 I guess it will be Jamarcus Russell.

41. Kwaku Says:
    September 14th, 2008 at 3:52 am

    Jason Whitlock’s mission is to call it like it is, as he sees it. This is not equivalent to being the house nigger. That so many of you here see it that way is a testimonial to your own grouchy insecurities. Unless he toes the party line of “whites evil” and “blacks oppressed,” then your knee jerk reaction is to dismiss him as Uncle Tom. Lame thinking.

42. Mizzo Says:
    September 14th, 2008 at 5:06 pm

    Yo whoever the Buzz you are. You are not going to come here and paint us with a elephant faced brush.

    It’s not about whitey for the last time. It’s about how Black athletes are treated as it relates to the truth.

    Read The Starting Five is people so you have a full knowledge of what we do here. You will not diminish our aim with your ignorance (you’re the cat at 2:02).

    You get no burn here. The end of the bench–or better yet, the waiver wire–awaits…

    Be Peace

43. thegme*is*thegme! Says:
    September 14th, 2008 at 8:17 pm

    Dude here it is white black whatever Football is Football these boys get alot of damn money to prove there skills. Back up to patrick up there with his comments on mcnabb and vick and etc.
    Lets see McNabb choked the superbowl… Vick is the pen… and young is crying on the sidelines cause he cant stand the heat in the kitchen…wonder why thery are number one on the medias list…! Give me a break if you dont want the drama stop fuckin up!

44. Eric Daniels Says:
    September 14th, 2008 at 8:46 pm

    I see the trolls have arrived in full force, when it’s a Black QB and jason Whitlock they always show up to put their 2 cents in whether their opinion advances the conversation or not. If you can’t post your real name then stay on your racist sports sites and stop lurking around like a parasite looking for something to feed on.

45. origin Says:
    September 15th, 2008 at 12:16 am

    Exactly Eric. You don’t see these jerks until then. Kwaku you are so freaking off base its ridiculous.

    Whitlock is a pandering fool. This is a dude who called black males that went to the Las Vegas All-star game black KKKs. This a dude who called black women who went to the same game baby mommas and ghetto hood rats.

46. Mizzo Says:
    September 15th, 2008 at 12:22 am

    This is also the same cat who called C. Vivian Stringer Nelson Womandela. I had to call Dan LeBatard out in our interview for merely laughing at something I thought was very disrespectful.

    Why journalists give this cat a modicum of respect is beyond me.

47. Temple3 Says:
    September 18th, 2008 at 4:07 pm

    Whitlock gets props from white writers because he can say what they cannot say. He gets props from Black writers because he makes more money than they do.

    No rocket science here. A simple case of Anti-Black Propaganda.

48. Mizzo Says:
    September 18th, 2008 at 4:23 pm

    I think it’s deeper than that brotha. There is a serious disdain for young black men in the niche Whitlock and similar cats like Stanley Crouch have landed in.

49. Loretta Says:
    October 3rd, 2008 at 5:31 am

    My nephew knows VY personally. They grew up in the same neighborhood therefore there are people that are far more familiar with VY inside than out. People are going to always talk so that may be Vince’s shortcoming that he wants to please people. Well, heck I do too but no matter how well I do something, someone will always be dissatisfied. Therefore, one has to take the good with the bad. I once put VY in the mentally tough category with MJ, KB, TWoods and Serena Williams . I will still leave him in that category because from what I know about Vince he is a very mentally tough individual and I can assure you that he will figure things out. He wants to be considered as the very best and should he hang in there, he has the potential to be one of the very best if not the best. Of course he isn’t the best passer because he relies on running and his arms strength but once he combines it, he can be right where he is expected to be. He is still young but the world doesn’t give a care about age or excuses, they want results and that is okay as well because that is what he gets paid to do. I think VY is putting a lot of pressure on himself. I will compare him with Serena though she is a proven success story but since I’ve observed her a lot closer over the years, she wears all of her losses oh her shoulders as opposed to her sister, Venus. Serena beats herself up constantly over losing but then she redeems herself. Her losses motivate her to win. I know that football is a team sport as opposed to tennis but the quarterback position has a lot of components that rely on other individuals as well but the ultimate decision while on the field is to make wise choices. I think once VY figures out that he is human and not Superman and tune out all of the negativity, I think he will redeem himself. Heck, Kobe didn’t perform as well as people thought he would against the Celtics in championship but I bet he doesn’t allow that to stop him. So, once VY gets a taste of the “real world” which he is now suddenly experiencing, he will be back on top of his game. He is not a quitter and it is my belief that by the time he ends his career, he will become one of the best quarterbacks in the league. I can’t assure of that but I can darn sure make a good prediction. VY knows that “only the strong will survive” and he is strong so I know he will survive. I have got to give him my prayers because he is my hometown hero and we must believe in him. In addition, I give everyone my prayers to succeed in whatever it is that their hearts desire or whatever it is that God placed them here on earth to do. I believe that God placed VY here to play football and he will be successful and a lot sooner than people think. Come on VY!

50. Truth Monger Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 5:38 pm

    I’m a Titans fan, and was just seeing if there was anything new on the VY mental breakdown after he got booed the first game of the season. I was at that game, and it was not known to the crowd that Vince tried to pull himself from the game, and that he pouted on the sideline like a little girl.

    If my VY jersey didn’t cost so much, I’d have already thrown it away by now, but what again does Vince being black have anything to do with anything?

    Mizzo, you write like you think you’re a genius, but you just use race as a crutch, and it makes you look small. Race isn’t something to be celebrated, mocked, shamed, or otherwise. It’s just the color of your skin. Nothing more, nothing less. And, your issue w/ Jason Whitlock is totally funny. You wish you could be him so bad it hurts your feeble mind.

51. Matthew Fudge Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 6:27 pm

    It’s ironic your name has “Truth” in it. Allow me to explain:

    First of all, forget Mizzo’s issues with Whitlock. That falls under one man’s opinion, which as a U.S. citizen he’s entitled to. Race was, is, and always will be an issue in this country. Barack Obama’s ascendancy to the White House does NOT mean that we have overcome. Does that mean that VY doesn’t have issues that, as a grown-a– man, he needs to address? Of course not. This ain’t college; this is the NFL, where you can be the MVP or Coach of the Year one season and get cut or fired the next (thanks to the players’ non-guaranteed contracts). Ask Tom Brady what happens when you’re injured or otherwise not capable of playing. Life will go on, the games will still be played, and people will forget about you. VY needs to grow up, tell his mother to go SAT DOWN, and handle his business. That being said, race is still capable of coloring any situation. If you don’t think so, tell me why Tony Romo gets a pass for now saying the same things that would’ve gotten T.O. shouted at? Is one reason because T.O.’s a cancer-causing moron? Sure. But don’t sit there and say race has nothing to do with it. America loves their black athletes to stay quiet, humble and eternally grateful that white folks opened the door for us like they did us a favor. If we’re going to be loud and outspoken, white folks want us to be funny as well instead of arrogant and sullen (see Charles Barkley vs. Barry Bonds).

52. Matthew Fudge Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 6:47 pm

    Better yet, tell me what you think would happen if Donovan McNabb really heard the clock ticking on his athletic career and put Jeff Lurie on blast for being cheap and not surrounding him with quality players? If Brady called everyone in the front office cheapskate morons, guess what? He would be lauded as someone who really, REALLY wants to win (with Brownnosers Berman and Madden leading the way, of course). McNabb would, in so many words, be told to stay in his place.

    http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3025308

53. Mizzo Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 7:12 pm

    “Truth” Monger read my interviews with Scoop and Jason and there you have it. Look at more than what is in front of your face and you’ll understand much better–or not.

    I could care less.

54. michelle Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 7:28 pm

    Truth Monger,

    Are you not a US citizen? Race has always been an issue in this country. You people that come on here with that garbage make me laugh. Whitlock? Mizzo wants to be him? LOL!!!! Your kidding right? Whitlock is an ass. Who’s using being black as a crutch? If your black in this country you have to be better in order to get ahead. You don’t get a free ride. I was just thinking to myself this am. If Obama was McCain, he would never have been even nominated for president. If Obama graduated at the bottom of his class at he Naval Academy after getting help from his daddy to get there, cheated on and left his wife who waited for him 5 yrs while he was a prisoner of war, after she was in a horrible accident that almost killed her. Then goes on to marry the mistress who later becomes addicted to drugs steals from her foundation and is charged and convicted of the crime. McCain then in these horrible economic times selects a VP candidate who doesn’t even know the definition of the job she’s been nominated for. Has only a degree in journalism that takes her 5 different schools to get. Who has a pregnant daughter who’s boyfriend drops out of his senior year of high school to marry her and support the child who’s mother is arrested for dealing drugs. HE WOULD HAVE BEEN LAUGHED OUT OF POLITICS! SO DON’T COME ON THIS SITE WITH YOUR SMALL MIND AND ACT LIKE RACE DOESN’T MATTER OR I WILL BE FORCED TO GIVE YOU EVEN MORE OF THE TRILLIONS OF REASONS WHY IT HAS MATTERED IN THESE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA!!!!! YOU CAN’T HANDLE THE TRUTH!!!!!

55. Matthew Fudge Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 7:36 pm

    Michelle,

    God forbid if one of Obama’s daughters was a teenager and pregnant. It would have turned into a referendum on black men as a whole. Michelle better make sure when they’re old enough, they’re on every type of birth control available. They won’t get the Palin pass. The father won’t be able to stand with the young lady at a press conference. As for Obama’s presidency, well, you know.

56. Truth Monger Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 7:38 pm

    I didn’t understand this was a racial site when I got here, and while I don’t agree with using one’s race as a reason or a solution to a problem, I understand that’s your argument, Mizzo, and I apologize for trying to clown you based on an article taken out of context.

    I like to argue things based on reality and not feelings, though, so it’s hard to know what to do with a site like this.

    I tried to find the Scoop and Jason interviews, but couldn’t.

57. Truth Monger Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 7:43 pm

    Michelle, what are you talking about?

    Obama won with little experience, and virtually no accomplishments. You bringing up McCain’s past marital difficulties and Palin’s daughter issues just show that you can’t make a political argument, only an irrational emotional one.

58. Matthew Fudge Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 7:44 pm

    Truth Monger,

    At its core, this site still is basically about sports. What separates this site from a lot of others is that the author and the people who post messages on this site understand race and politics are intertwined with sports. Dr. King verbally admitted that he would’ve had a harder time heading the Civil Rights movement if it wasn’t for Jackie Robinson. The stances that Ali, John Carlos and Tommie Smith took in the ’60s helped people realize that, hey, the Vietnam War shouldn’t be fought.

    Just be yourself, write what you feel and let the chips fall where they may. It’s not about being agreed with; it’s about having a voice and learning from someone you might not necessarily agree with.

59. Matthew Fudge Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 7:46 pm

    Got a question, Truth: when they tried to impeach Clinton in the ’90s for getting brain in the Oval Office, was that a political move or an emotional/moral one?

60. michelle Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 7:47 pm

    Not that there is anything wrong with having a degree in journalism. LOL!

61. Matthew Fudge Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 7:52 pm

    “You bringing up McCain’s past marital difficulties and Palin’s daughter issues just show that you can’t make a political argument, only an irrational emotional one.”

    “Truth”, there’s a reason Obama ran a practically flawless campaign. He knew, like all black people know, that he had less margin for error. You’d be hard-pressed to find a black man or woman who wasn’t told as a child that they had to be twice as good as a white person to win the same race. On top of that, he was the first black candidate to win the Presidential election. Go ask Rachel Robinson what it was like for her husband, Jackie. There’s a reason Jackie died at 53 (when he looked at least 10 years older). Being the first black ANYTHING in this country is still rough, even though we as black people have made huge advancements. Obama represented all of black America (fair or unfair). That’s no joke.

62. Truth Monger Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 7:55 pm

    Ha. Clinton was purely a political move staged to look like moral outrage. Nice try, Republicans, but there was no meat on that bone. (no pun intended)

63. Mizzo Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 8:03 pm

    Truth stick to the script. You called me out with no historical value to speak of.

64. Matthew Fudge Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 8:05 pm

    “I like to argue things based on reality and not feelings, though, so it’s hard to know what to do with a site like this.”

    “Truth”, one thing you have to realize: there’s no way a reporter, columnist, or blogger can truly be objective. Oh, he or she might strive for objectivity. But the fact that we all come from different races, backgrounds, environments, and circumstances color (pardon the pun) how we see the world. There’s no getting around that.

    One other thing, “Truth”: not everyone who posts their comments is a journalist. I’m certainly not a journalist and don’t pretend that I am; I don’t write for a newspaper or a website. I’m just a guy who loves sports (warts and all) and am eternally grateful that a website that like this exists where people can give honest, uncompromising opinions about the world we live in. There’s not enough of that going on in MSM, which makes sites like this all the more important.

65. michelle Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 8:07 pm

    Truth Monger,

    Now I know you are a joke. Argument over!

    Obama has degrees from Columbia and Harvard. His wife from Princeton and Harvard. His running mate and his wife both are Professors. The best presidents this country have had the least amount of experience. Palin couldn’t define the job she was being asked to do and thought being able to see Russia from her house gave her foreign policy experience. I personally don’t have an issue with Palins daughters situation. However, in this country that kind of situation matters in politics. O’Reilly and Limbaugh were all over Lynn Spears when she became pregnant without being married. Called her parents names and said they were bad parents. However, suddenly there was nothing wrong with being pregnant in high school and unmarried when McCain selected Palin. Media bias.
    McCains own people came out after the election and called Palin stupid so what the hell are you talking about? Obama is both capable and highly intelligent he understands government and is well read on the subject. He wouldn’t have gotten us into the war in Iraq that has aided in the economic down turn in this country. Wasting the lives of our men and women in uniform and costing us a ridiculous amount of money.

66. Truth Monger Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 8:09 pm

    Obama’s victory is awesome for those who are inspired by it on whatever level they are, but Jackie Robinson succeeded based on merits, Obama’s placed on a pedastal because of his race.

    That’s very irrational.

67. Matthew Fudge Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 8:14 pm

    “Clinton was purely a political move staged to look like moral outrage.”

    Of course it was. That’s why the impeachment itself was so hypocritical. There are three things Washington, D.C. is about: money, power, and sex. You could make the argument that politicians cheat more than athletes. You don’t believe me, do a little research regarding the cities where Democratic and Republican National Conventions are held and tell me if escort services, prostitutes, hookers and hoes don’t clean up. Robert Livingston and another politician were busted for cheating on their wives during the impeachment process, but for them, it was somehow different. But because Clinton got caught, the country was supposedly going to hell in a handbasket. They should’ve just let Hillary handle her business, told Ken Starr to go away, and we could’ve all just moved on.

68. Matthew Fudge Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 8:20 pm

    “Jackie Robinson succeeded based on merits, Obama’s placed on a pedastal because of his race.”

    “Truth”, do you understand what’s being said here? In an ideal world, race would never be an issue. A black man or woman would be based solely on the content of their character. But this is the real world we live in. Pedestal? Because he’s black?? In what world? I don’t think so. Besides, do you realize how long it would’ve taken for another black baseball player to break through the color barrier if Jackie Robinson had failed? Then white folks would’ve said, “See? We gave you a shot, and you crapped the bed. Game over.” That kind of pressure is difficult to comprehend.

69. Truth Monger Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 8:21 pm

    Right on, Fudge.

    There is no other lower form of life than a politician.

    Early, I saw in Obama something that seemed above the scum of politics, but that faded and he seems no different, and no more willing to change the system than George Bush.

    They’re all crooks, and I don’t agree w/ Bill Ayers, but serious social unrest seems like the only way to wake America up.

70. Matthew Fudge Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 8:26 pm

    “Truth”, wait ’til the draft gets reinstated. Then people will have to turn away from watching “American Idol” and say, “Wait a minute. What…what the hell?”

    Is the jury still out on Obama? Sure. He hasn’t had the chance to prove himself. But you can’t tell me that four more years of the bullcrap with McCain in office would’ve done the country any good. This country BADLY needed change, by any means necessary. Every American owes Bush a debt of gratitude. If it weren’t for his incompetence, Obama would’ve never won.

71. Truth Monger Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 8:27 pm

    We disagree, Fudge.

    Obama was totally placed on a pedestal.

    He gave a wonderful speech at the DNC in ‘04, and he used his political capital from that event to ascend to the Presidency. You tell me, besides on the inspiration of the man if you buy into that, why should Obama be President?
    Because it’s time for a black President?
    Because he speaks well?
    Because it hasn’t been shown that he cheats on his wife?
    Because he can raise lots of money?
    Because of his past voting record?

    What makes Obama qualified to be President?

72. michelle Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 8:29 pm

    Truth Monger,

    Obama earned his place in history. He ran the best campaign in history. How else could he beat the Clintons? Also his cabinet picks have been praised by people on both sides of the isle. You are the only irrational person on this blog today. That comment alone has hidden racism. We are irrational? No, we are professional and intelligent people. We blog here to be informed, entertained and also to let off some steam when we here from clowns like you. So what exactly are you trying to say?

73. michelle Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 8:33 pm

    How about he voted against having one of the worst wars in the history of the United States. How about because he is highly intelligent. McCain would have put this country at risk if he became president, died and left Tina Fey to run the country. Are you serious? Really????????

74. Matthew Fudge Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 8:33 pm

    “Truth”, what exactly qualified Dubya to be President? Everything he touched turned to crap, he couldn’t even run the Texas Rangers, and he’s famously known for giving “C” students a bad name while at Yale. But I don’t recall anyone getting in his face about his qualifications the way they did Obama (check out the “60 Minutes” interview on Obama that was aired last Sunday). The guy pressed Obama so hard about his qualifications, I wanted Obama to reach across and smack the hell out of him and say, “Because I want to run, dammit!!”

75. Matthew Fudge Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 8:39 pm

    “Truth”, it’s like I said before, white people don’t do angry, confrontational black people well. If Obama was put on a pedestal, it was because white people don’t see him as a threat. From a comedy standpoint, think of Obama as the Bill Cosby of presidential candidates. If another brother came off as confrontational like Bernie Mac or Paul Mooney, there’d be no pedestal for him to stand on.

76. michelle Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 8:40 pm

    Truth Monger,

    I welcome a debate but make some sense. PLEASE!

77. Matthew Fudge Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 8:47 pm

    Give me 5 things that made Bush qualified to run this country. If you can do that, I’ll stand down.

78. Truth Monger Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 9:04 pm

    “Hidden racism,” Michelle?

    I meant for my statement to be politically motivated, not racially motivated, and I was criticizing your emotions, not your race, but I can see where see my words could be seen as having a racial tinge to them if someone wanted to make that argument.

    Definitely not my intention, and I apologize if you took offense to it, but I feel like we can’t have a discussion on these topics if comments like what I said are going to be construed as racial. I’m a political beast, not a racial one, and I don’t really feel like filtering myself for fear of being called a racist. I think Liberals are irrational, so I said it. I don’t know if one person on here is black or white and don’t care.

    I just got on this site to do some reading on Vince Young.

79. michelle Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 9:18 pm

    Truth Monger,

    Ok. Liberals… irrational?? Good talking to you and I’m sorry I called you a clown. We obviously just have a HUGE difference of opinion.

80. Matthew Fudge Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 9:19 pm

    Where Obama was concerned, race was always going to be an issue. There’s no avoiding that.

    “Truth”, I’ll let you in on a secret. Talking about race gives black folks a headache. Just discussing prejudice and racism can drain you as a black person, simply because it’s in your face all the time. We don’t have the luxury of picking it up and putting it down at our convenience. Race will always be a significant factor in the lives of black people, simply because it’s always a part of our daily experience.

81. michelle Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 9:25 pm

    Matthew Fudge,

    Well said!

82. Matthew Fudge Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 9:28 pm

    Just trying to keep up with you, Michelle.

83. Patrick Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 9:33 pm

    Going through the presidential campaign which last two years is the ultimate vetting process, and Obama passed with flying colors. Obama showed himself to be competent on the issues ranging from the Constituion to the economy, and was able to fight off attacks from the corporate-owned pseudo conservative media. Conservatives who try to say Obama was given a pass is delusional. Just as delusional as the RNC candidate trying to pass off Puff the Magic Negro as satire or the terrorists fist pump stuff.

    He made his case to the American people–especially at the debates, and he won convincingly.

    As for Vince Young, he has overcome obstacles in college and fought off criticism that he could not succeed as a QB, and became a NCAA champion at Texas. Vince won with his style of play and a competent, supportive coaching staff. Old school conservative commentators still can’t get over Vince Young outclassing the golden boy Matt Leinart and USC four years ago. Haters will be haters.

    Vince is 25, and has been to a Pro Bowl and has taken his team to the playoffs. He has had to deal with an internal struggle among management in regards to surrounding him with personnel and a coaching staff and philosophy that is tailored around his talents. Hiring Norm Chow, Leinart’s former coach, was a prime example of what they thought of Vince Young, and it was a matter of time before things fell apart. If Tennessee didn’t want Vince as he was, they should have left him alone. However, Vince was drafted and essentially SAVED FISHER’S JOB… and now they are turning their back on Vince..

    There may be some parallels with Obama seen as a savior, and if he saves the American economy and produce JOBS, then will white mainstream America, say thanks and try to impeach him from office..?

    Vince was temporarily put into a forced exile by the Titans. Other young franchise QBs struggle and often LOSE (Cutler, Leinart, Edwards,Brodie Coyle, etc.), but in most cases stay on the field, but the mainstream media wanted to put Vince on a pedestal, just like Obama, not because they LIKE HIM or the perceived face of the NFL, but they are attempting to set him up to fail. The underlying criticism of being a dual threat QB has always been there. The questioning of his intelligence and other black QBs (even McNabb’s) has always been part of the discussion in the media, sports talk radio and message boards.

    Vince is in a bad situation right now, and he should demand a trade. If Tennessee respects him and feels they can do better, they should just let him go. The Titans’ biggest fear is that Vince will go to another team and take that team to the playoffs or win a Super Bowl.

84. Truth Monger Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 9:35 pm

    Michelle, I am a clown, and I think ALL politicians are irrational.

    We do have a difference of opinion, but that’s all good.

    Happy New Year to all!

85. michelle Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 9:36 pm

    Patrick,

    WOW! Your my hero!

86. michelle Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 9:37 pm

    Truth Monger,

    It’s cool. Happy New Year to you!

87. Matthew Fudge Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 9:45 pm

    “He has had to deal with an internal struggle among management in regards to surrounding him with personnel and a coaching staff and philosophy that is tailored around his talents. Hiring Norm Chow, Leinart’s former coach, was a prime example of what they thought of Vince Young.”

    Patrick, it’s no different than being in a relationship. If you don’t smoke, does it make sense to be with someone with a two-pack-a-day habit? If your idea of fun on weekends is a Blockbuster night, does it make sense to be with someone who hits the clubs every week? If your idea of sex on the regular is once a month (God forbid), does it make sense to be with someone who’ll ride you raw and have you curled up in the fetal position sucking your thumb and talking to yourself? No!! So why would Tennessee draft Young if they didn’t like his style? If you don’t like the way he plays, DON’T DRAFT HIM!! Some things aren’t that complicated.

88. Matthew Fudge Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 9:52 pm

    “There may be some parallels with Obama seen as a savior, and if he saves the American economy and produce JOBS, then will white mainstream America, say thanks and try to impeach him from office..?”

    Can’t honestly answer that one. I’d like to think that, instead of people looking for reasons to impeach Obama, he would be appreciated by white America. But you know how politicians and lawmakers are. They’ll change the rules in the middle of the game and look at you like the rules were there from day 1.

89. Patrick Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 9:59 pm

    “There may be some parallels with Obama seen as a savior, and if he saves the American economy and produce JOBS, then will white mainstream America, say thanks and try to impeach him from office..?”

    …..”"”Can’t honestly answer that one. I’d like to think that, instead of people looking for reasons to impeach Obama, he would be appreciated by white America. But you know how politicians and lawmakers are. They’ll change the rules in the middle of the game and look at you like the rules were there from day 1….”"”

    Matt,

    I should clarify a little bit.. instead of white mainstream America, I really meant to say obstructionist , conservative Republicans who really don’t care about the middle class or working class…but more dedicated in tripping up Obama with faux scandals like Reverend Wright or Blago’s scandal up in Illinois.

    1994 could happen in 2010 (i.e. Newt Gingrich’s Contract on America nonsense)

90. Matthew Fudge Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 10:04 pm

    I’m still tripping off Tim Wise’s article about Jeremiah Wright on counterpunch.org. Almost saw steam coming out of my laptop.

91. Truth Monger Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 10:05 pm

    Fudge, I find it interesting that you say white people can pick up racial issues and just leave them when they feel like it, but I don’t get it. I don’t see the world racially, and I don’t know people who do.

    I don’t like Obama, and people call me racist. Does that mean they’re right? I don’t like Obama b/c of his Leftist policies, but that doesn’t seem to matter almost.

    And, I get that he is an inspiration to black people for what he represents, but he is going to be tore down from the moment he steps into office, and it will have nothing to do with his race. The crossing of those two identities will not meet a pretty fate, and it’s shameful to think that some people will be labeled as racist simply b/c of disagreement.

    Further, for Patrick the Vince supporter:
    I was the biggest Vince fan til I heard he didn’t want to but was made to play in a playoff game last year, and after he didn’t wanna go into a game this year after he was booed. He’s a big baby. I was at that game, and I’ve heard much louder booing for much lesser offenses. It was his second interception of the day, and the team wasn’t doing much.

    I didn’t boo Vince, but he does need to play better. He had something like 55 yards in 2 1/2 quarters this past Sunday.

92. Patrick Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 10:13 pm

    ….”So why would Tennessee draft Young if they didn’t like his style? If you don’t like the way he plays, DON’T DRAFT HIM!! Some things aren’t that complicated…..”

    True.

93. Matthew Fudge Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 10:17 pm

    “Fudge, I find it interesting that you say white people can pick up racial issues and just leave them when they feel like it, but I don’t get it.”

    My mistake, “Truth”. I should’ve been more specific and said WHITE people had and still have the CHOICE of picking that particular mantle up. White people don’t have their lives defined by race. Black people do. That’s the point I was trying to make. You as an individual don’t see the world through the prism of race because you don’t have to. You’re free to live your life away from that.

    For example, when Jayson Blair was busted for plaigarism by the NY Times, affirmative action was called on the carpet. All because ONE black reporter messed up. But if that was a white reporter, it would’ve been appropriately reported as one person messing up. White men as a whole wouldn’t been put on blast. Andy Reid’s sons got busted for selling drugs out of his house, yet you didn’t hear people say white men make bad fathers (in fact, aside from the fact that Tony Dungy seems to be a genuinely nice guy, one of the reasons that MSM didn’t put him or black men in general on blast after his son committed suicide is that even they weren’t cruel enough to go there. But that scenario is always present). Black people are always judged under a group dynamic (as well as individually) because that’s how we were brought to this country.

94. Matthew Fudge Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 10:21 pm

    “I don’t like Obama, and people call me racist. Does that mean they’re right? I don’t like Obama b/c of his Leftist policies, but that doesn’t seem to matter almost.”

    It is a shame that in this politically-correct age, people can’t agree to disagree. I’m sure there were some black people that didn’t vote for Obama. That doesn’t make them self-hating racists. But that’s where we are in 2008: black people yelling from one side, white people yelling from the other, and nobody’s really being heard.

95. Patrick Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 10:34 pm

    ….” Further, for Patrick the Vince supporter:
    I was the biggest Vince fan til I heard he didn’t want to but was made to play in a playoff game last year, and after he didn’t wanna go into a game this year after he was booed. He’s a big baby. I was at that game, and I’ve heard much louder booing for much lesser offenses. It was his second interception of the day, and the team wasn’t doing much.

    I didn’t boo Vince, but he does need to play better. He had something like 55 yards in 2 1/2 quarters this past Sunday……”

    That’s BS. Vince has always been a competitor throughout his whole football career (throughout high school to the pros)…

    If he couldn’t go into a game, it was because he was injured. And the media was pushing this BSPN rumor as a fact. There was an existing tension between Norm Chow and Vince, and I recall watching a NBC Sunday night telecast against Indy in which Andrea Kremer was interviewing Chow on the sideline, and he was bad-mouthing Vince about his perceived work ethic…

    Vince was definitely in and still is in a very negative situation with the Titans..THAT’S THE REAL ISSUE.

    The coaching staff is trying to turn into Joe Montana or Peyton Manning instead of finding a coordinator who respects Vince Young instead of having an existing vendetta from the USC-Texas game as in one Norm Chow. Peyton Manning had the same coach from Day One and so has Tom Brady when he was playing as well as Joe Montana.

    If the Titans wanted to go to the college ranks then find coaches who have experience with dual-threat QBs such as Ralph Freidgn from Maryland..or maybe a Hue Jackson and Cam Cameron (now assistants in Baltimore). Cameron used to be a college coach at Indiana when Antawn Randle-El was there several years ago. Now Cameron and Jackson are having some success in preparing Joe Flacco in Baltimore. Cameron was available and the Titans should have been more aggressive and tried to acquire him.

    Good coaches are out there if the Titans were truly dedicated in helping Vince be an effective player for the Titans. However, it seems they want to do the opposite and pass off as if they are doing something…

96. Truth Monger Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 10:47 pm

    Do the Obama supporters on here see anything wrong with Obama?

    I’m not looking to argue, really, and I am not going to bash Obama.

97. Matthew Fudge Says:
    December 30th, 2008 at 10:51 pm

    I don’t see anything wrong with him. Just hope he follows through on the majority of his promises.

98. Truth Monger Says:
    December 31st, 2008 at 5:47 am

    Patrick,

    I have followed Vince and the Titans for years. And, what is the “negative situation” you speak of in TN?

    If you wanna take it there, Steve McNair was, and is, revered for his ability on the field. His toughness was legendary, but Vince has not earned that respect yet b/c he has not accomplished much in the NFL.

    Vince put on, in my opinion, the single greatest performance in a college national championship game, and he has shown flashes of brilliance in the NFL, but unless you can prove yourself, I doubt you know more than me about the Titans or about Vince Young, Patrick, and don’t try to paint his struggles as anything more than a self-imposed screw up on his part. His mom is the one that called Jeff Fisher. (long story, short)

    As a Titans fan, I want VY to win 10 Super Bowls, but looking at him, I see a problem. He sees boos as a personal attack to his character, and it’s not. It’s all about how you perform between the lines.

    What am I missing?

99. Patrick Says:
    December 31st, 2008 at 12:23 pm

    ….”What am I missing?…”

    How can I put this? Am I am not trying to be a comedian, but you are missing EVERYTHING…

    I think I pretty much explained myself in the earlier posts.

    The ‘long and short’ of it, for Titans’ management/coaching staff to take Vince off the field completely after one game in YEAR 3, in a totally unprecedented move toward a franchise QB who was rookie of the year in 2006, and then led the team to the playoffs in his second year, was a slap in the face…and really sends a message the Titans organization doesn’t respect you and feel you are incapable of leading THIS TEAM.

    Okay, Fisher and management can take that stand… If they believe Kerry Collins and Chris Simms can hold it down, then let Vince Young go in this 2008 offseason via a trade and try to part ways amicably. MOVE ON.

    The Titans shouldn’t continue to hold Vince’s career hostage by innuendo, spite and contempt.

    Steve McNair sat on the bench watching Chris Chandler in non-playoff years for two seasons in 1995 and 1996, and played better in 1997 and 1998.. Finally, in his fifth year McNair along with the franchise RB Eddie George the Titans made the playoffs.

    Vince was put in the proverbial fire early after a 0-4 Kerry Collins start in YEAR ONE. Why? Because Fisher wanted to SAVE HIS JOB!!!! And Vince put Tennessee in a position to steal a wild card and got fan excited about the franchise again, but Collins’ poor start was just too much as the Titans finished with a 8-8 record.

    As you say: ….”It’s all about how you perform between the lines…” Yeah, right..

    So 8-8, then 10-6 isn’t accomplishing anything? Well, we see that differently. Could there be room for improvement for VY? Yes, but sitting him on the bench because haters in your fanbase/media and across the country want a reincarnation of Joe Montana or Peyton is unfair and cynical and attempting to micro-manage every incomplete pass is equally cynical.

    Titans management chose to take Vince off the field. Vince didn’t do it to himself. Pac Man Jones is an example of someone who took himself off the field with his actions.

100. Temple3 Says:
     December 31st, 2008 at 3:00 pm

     ROTFLMBAO.

     Someone actually had the balls to write they didn’t like Obama because of his “leftist” policies — even though his cabinet is chock full of mainstream, traditional economic and military advisors (including Goldman Sachs crooks and Federal Reserve Bank hustlers).

     That’s the funniest shit I’ve read in a long time. “Leftist policies.” ROTFLMBAO….oh, I don’t think I’ll be getting up for awhile. “Leftist” :0 Absolutely hilarious. Larry Summers, Greithner, Susan Rice, Gates — whew! That’s rich.

101. Truth Monger Says:
     December 31st, 2008 at 3:15 pm

     Oh, okay, I see.

     Vince is black, hence his benching is based on that, and that’s about as deep as it gets here.

     Next.

102. Temple3 Says:
     December 31st, 2008 at 4:23 pm

     Patrick —

     I still think there are too many missing pieces from your interpretation of Tennessee and VY. Pardon me if I’ve missed your explanations in other posts. Please feel free to enlighten me.

     As I’ve said before — we certainly have agreed to disagree about the extent of the intervention by Fisher earlier this season. I believe that the use of words like “gun,” “car,” “suicide,” and “speeding” were sufficient cause for intervention that rose to the level of notification to the PD — especially given that the suppositions in play involved the safety of countless others (highway travelers). You do not. You believe the issue should have been handled in house and that regardless of an inability to contact VY during the critical moments, the concerns of his mother and associate should have been handled in a manner that first preserved his reputation. My worst case scenario was a high speed collision on the highway that kills innocent children. I believe your worst case scenario was a bad press conference, benching and public humiliation. Okay. I think that’s correct. I don’t think I’m overstating this, but I welcome correction. Rescue me if I’m wrong on this.

     The question of race with the Titans at the QB position just seems misplaced to me. This franchise has had a nearly uninterrupted tradition of Blacks at this position since 1984…that’s almost a QUARTER CENTURY. Norm Chow is gone. Vince is still there. The Titans clearly like what he offers or they would have drafted him. I have maintained that there was a split in the organization during the draft time about Vince or Leinart. I believe that someone told Norm Chow that the team would definitely draft Leinart. I believe that’s the only reason he accepted the job — and perhaps someone with the reputation and standing of Steve McNair lobbied on behalf of Vince — and that was the factor that determined the Titans draft pick.

     From what we’ve all seen on the field, the selection of Vince Young was far superior to the decision to draft Matt Leinart. That notwithstanding, both are riding the pine and Norm Chow is back in college.

     It’s not clear to me that the fact that Chris Chandler played while McNair is a sign of “racism.” It’s not like McNair was a random draft pick or that he didn’t actually become the franchise QB or even that Chandler was a bum. He wasn’t. He was the QB of the NFC champion Falcons in ‘98 and he make some big throws to get them to the SB. He was fragile though. Moreover, different franchises have different approaches to whether or not guys should start as soon as they come out of college. Manning and Aikman took their lumps right away. Philip Rivers watched. Others who have had tremendous success have had to wait awhile. I believe the approaches are too varied to ascribe “racism” to the time McNair sat while in Houston. (Now, if you wanted to talk about his unceremonious departure, that might be different.)

     I don’t know all the particulars of what happened. I think you just need to share a bit more about what you actually know that drives your sentiment. I just can’t see where your coming from on this. If Vince was traded and Chow was still in Tennessee, I could see it. If Fisher was bad mouthing Vince, I could see it. If Vince was a pariah in his own locker room, I could see it. If Vince was a “race man” who stood behind McNair or McNabb when related questions were put to him, I could see it. He ain’t that dude.

     I haven’t heard you say that post-Chow, VY’s work ethic is unquestioned. I haven’t heard you say that like Tavaris Jackson, VY has clearly progressed in making reads on the field and in getting the ball downfield to speedy, talented, but underutilized receivers (I’m not talking about that scrub of all scrubs Justin McCareins.) I haven’t heard you say that the Titans locker room is split along racial lines because players believe a great injustice was done to Vince. I haven’t heard any of that.

     What I have heard, without demonstration, is the proclamation that VY has been significantly harmed due to racial animus on the part of an organization that has had Black QBs (while playing in the deep South — formerly in Texas, then in the birthplace of the Klan) for almost 25 years.

     I think you can see why I have a problem with what you’re advancing. Help me to see what I’m missing. Thanks. And happy new year to all.

     (I apologize for the length, but I wanted to be as clear as possible.)

103. Temple3 Says:
     December 31st, 2008 at 4:25 pm

     TM:

     Your sarcasm sucks. “Here” is not a place where a lack of analysis will usually suffice. If you’re going to suggest otherwise, I suggest you ditch the sarcasm and commence to doing some heavy lifting. Save the sideline banter for another site where it will be well received. It won’t work “here.”

104. Patrick Says:
     December 31st, 2008 at 7:53 pm

     Temple.

     Let me make this clear’er’… I don’t think Jeff Fisher is against Vince Young. I don’t believe the Titans’ organization hate Vince Young or that they are blatantly racist.

     However, they have made bad judgments in the way they handled the Vince Young ordeal, and should be held accountable.

     Fisher is a football coach, not a clubhouse counselor nor a security detail guy. He was reckless in the way he handled the situation even though he had good intentions. There is and should always be consequences nonetheless.

     When he called the police with inaccurate third-party information, he could have been ‘technically’ viewed as filing a false police report…

     Before I go any further Temple…. this is about BAD JUDGMENT BY JEFF FISHER, NOT ABOUT RACE in this specific issue in regards to Vince Young…the Titans’ history of considering a black QB isn’t in play here…SO LET’S SEPARATE THIS RIGHT NOW… temple your assertion that: …”the proclamation that VY has been significantly harmed due to racial animus on the part of an organization that has had Black QBs…” does NOT minimize (in my view) the egregious error of judgment Coach Fisher made in handling this matter…

     Fisher filed a false police report, but was not charged… and Temple when you say this:

     …”I believe that the use of words like “gun,” “car,” “suicide,” and “speeding” were sufficient cause for intervention that rose to the level of notification to the PD — especially given that the suppositions in play involved the safety of countless others (highway travelers)….”

     There are buzz words, but there was no evidence of VY speeding or any police reports reflecting any negative criminal, illegal behavior..You may think public humiliation is just a small consequence, but sometimes people go to court over that (i.e. libel, defamation of character, etc…)

     And actually when you mention this intervention could have saved lives well, lets look at a definition of a filing a false report and why doing so is not a good thing…

     ****Class B misdemeanor, fine and possible short jail sentence. You are liable for additional charges and civil damages if your report were to tie up resources that were needed to intervene in another location w/ resulting damages.*****

     I am not saying Fisher should go to jail, but he made a very bad decision, and should have and could have handled it better. He had other QUALIFIED resources within the Titans’ organization with legal and counselor expertise who would have provided Fisher with a better alternative than reporting third-hand information and inciting a media firestorm…and jeopardizing Vince Young’s career and the eventual BENCHING was really the straw that broke the proverbial camel’s back..

     Vince should ask out of Tennessee. Legally, he could take the Titans and Jeff Fisher to court…but Vince WOULD NOT do it..

     I believe Vince wants to move on (quietly), and there is a quote from the Tennessean prior to the last game of the season when Fisher decided to let him play two quarters in a worthless game…

     “It’s definitely big for me,” … “It’s like a resume for me to go out there and show that I can still play football at this level, and that’s basically it…”

     Vince wants out. Just an amicable break. Trade him. Cut him. Just let him go.

     Fisher isn’t a racist and I am not accusing the Titans’ organization either. Just move on with Kerry Collins and Chris Simms. And if VInce does well else, then so be it..

     Here’s more Fisher, backtracking, but admitting that he didn’t know…

     http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3586215

     “Some of that stuff in the report was just flat-out wrong …erroneous,” Fisher said. “It’s not an accurate portrayal of the events. I know. I was in the middle of it. And Vince is fine and he’s going to be fine …there’s going to be a positive outcome.”

     Specifically, Fisher clarified certain aspects of the police report he said are misleading:

     • Young was never at LP Stadium “let alone going off …with a gun,” as the report stated. In fact, a Nashville public information officer early Saturday morning also corrected the report and stated that Young never appeared at the stadium.

     • Vince Young does not have a personal therapist, as cited in the report. Fisher said the therapist, Sheila Peters, is employed by the club and is available on-site to all team personnel two or three days during the week.

     • It was Mike Mu, who is Young’s local marketing manager, who called Peters with the alarm that Young had left his home without his cell phone, threatening to quit and was speeding down the interstate with a gun in his car after talking about suicide. Peters, in turn, called Fisher with Mu’s account but she never spoke to directly with Young, as indicated in the report, until the end of the night.

     “Look, when I got the call from Sheila, she was reacting on [Mu's] story and I had no way to reach Vince because he didn’t have his phone. So I did what anybody would do — I called the police,” Fisher said. “Once the police are involved, there’s certain protocol that has to be followed.

     “So when Vince finally got home later that night, he called me and said, ‘What’s up?’ I told him he had to come down to the facility to meet with the police. Vince said, ‘I’m fine, coach.’ I said, ‘I know you’re fine but there’s a protocol now and you have to come down here and see the police face-to-face.’ And he did. They talked to him. Yes, there was a gun in the car — you can’t say that’s unusual with players these days — but it wasn’t loaded and the police didn’t have a problem with it. Then Sheila spoke with him and determined he was all right, too. And everybody went home.”

105. Temple3 Says:
     December 31st, 2008 at 9:02 pm

     Thanks Patrick. That helps. Just a couple of things:

     If Jeff Fisher was a colleague of Vince Young’s, I could entirely see your perspective. If they had a long-standing relationship and he experienced those events first hand, I could totally feel where you’re coming from. Since he didn’t have that luxury, I believe he gave the “benefit of the doubt” to the person who relayed the story. The other alternative would have been to essentially disregard the story and give the benefit to VY. In the calculus of worst case scenarios, which position is more reckless?

     I guess I’m just wondering what you would have done — how, if things had turned out differently, you would have explained your inaction to his mother, your bosses, the city of Nashville, the NFL and the families of other persons adversely impacted.

     You never deal with the mind set of the actors at the time of the event — only with the outcome. The outcome is irrelevant because it could not have been known at the time. Hence, my emphasis on our respective worst case scenarios. It’s not that I don’t think public humiliation is a big deal — it can be life defining and utterly tragic for some. Nonetheless, it usually pales in comparison to sudden death. I think you need to acknowledge that the possibility of death must have existed in the minds of some people making decisions here.

     Which brings me to this:

     1) Could you explain why you have so little regard for the statements make by Mike Mu? Do you know something the rest of us don’t know? His claims required a quick, decisive action. You call calling the police a reckless act by Fisher, but say nothing of VY’s actions. Why is that?

     2) Let’s assume that calling the police is an overreaction to hearing that a person in whom you’ve invested considerable time, effort and money is engaged in something with the potential for significantly adverse outcomes (and you have no means of contacting the person). What would this mean to you: “It was Mike Mu, who is Young’s local marketing manager, who called Peters with the alarm that Young had left his home without his cell phone, threatening to quit and was speeding down the interstate with a gun in his car after talking about suicide.”

     3) The same article you quote seems to indicate that Fisher has a strong commitment to Vince Young quarterbacking the Titans. Fisher is not the QB of the future. Why do you give such short shrift to that aspect of the article, but not others?

     4) Finally, you’ve quoted quite a bit of legal reasoning here. I’m no attorney, but I’m wondering if you’ve contemplated the Principle of the Reasonable Man as an explanation for why Jeff Fisher was not charged with filing a false police report. Fisher was not unreasonable in accepting the veracity of Mu’s claims. Mu did not have an apparent motive for lying or an obvious opportunity to gain from doing so. Moreover, his believe may have been supported by other factors: the reaction to being booed, the reaction to being benched; the reaction to being injured. I don’t think Fisher had anything to fear from the police.

     I don’t think they thought he was reckless. If anything, the police were reckless in writing the report and sharing it with the media. I think its possible that your critique should be directed at the police and the media since if they’d told the truth, there would not be a story. It seems like the one person who DID NOT behave in a reckless manner is the person you’ve pinpointed for just that.

     Thanks again.

106. Patrick Says:
     January 1st, 2009 at 5:26 am

     Agreeing to disagree once again.

     LOL.

     Happy New Year…

     To answer the title of this blog entry, Vince Young, Whatcha Gonna Do Bruh?..

     Well Vince may have given us clues… and that’s to START OVER WITH A NEW TEAM..and demand a trade in the offseason… and his opinion of receiving playing time is reflective of VY trying to move on..

     “It’s like a resume for me to go out there and show that I can still play football at this level, and that’s basically it…”

     And Temple when you say in your closing..”It seems like the one person who DID NOT behave in a reckless manner is the person you’ve pinpointed for just that…”

     The recklessness was a team effort from the media, police and the ringleader Coach Jeff Fisher.

     My retort is Fisher’s own words!

     “It’s not an accurate portrayal of the events. I know. I was in the middle of it…..”

     Now is the time for the potential consequences and Vince possibly leaving the Titans in a amicable manner via trade or being cut.

107. Temple3 Says:
     January 2nd, 2009 at 4:09 pm

     Mind you — I’m not defending Fisher as much as I’m trying to get YOU to identify two things:

     1) What you would have done - and how you would have explained it if the outcome had been far worse.
     2) The contributing acts of VY to this scenario.

     That’s really it. I feel as though I addressed your worst case scenario months ago. I believe you’ve continued to ignore the worst case scenario that was top of mind for Mike Mu, VY’s mother and Jeff Fisher. Why is that?

     Finally, if Fisher’s status has been bumped up to “ringleader” that’s a huge leap from:

     Let me make this clear’er’… I don’t think Jeff Fisher is against Vince Young. I don’t believe the Titans’ organization hate Vince Young or that they are blatantly racist.

     Don’t you know that RINGLEADERS are always, always, always against someone…and they almost always use hate as the vehicle to galvanize “the ring.” What’s changed since 2008, P? Holla back.

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